Posts by Doug Mason

26

Source material: "144,000" and "anointed" in The Watchtower, 2000-2015

by Doug Mason in

a collation of statements made in the watchtower from 2000 to 2015 of "144,000" and "anointed".

http://www.jwstudies.com/wt_magazines_from_2000_to_2015_on_144000_and_the_anointed.pdf .

doug.

Doug Mason

Charlie,

Do I know you from previous discussion as Lars/Larry/etc.? He told me that he was the Jesus Christ who had returned in 1992 and that he had met the resurrected Daniel.

Doug

26

Source material: "144,000" and "anointed" in The Watchtower, 2000-2015

by Doug Mason in

a collation of statements made in the watchtower from 2000 to 2015 of "144,000" and "anointed".

http://www.jwstudies.com/wt_magazines_from_2000_to_2015_on_144000_and_the_anointed.pdf .

doug.

Those NT writers (and editors/redactors) thought they were living at the very last of the Last Days, with the imminent divine intervention in prospect - in their own time, during "this generation". An example is at Revelation 22:7, 12, 20: "I am coming soon."

They were wrong. This idea of an imminent divine intervention has been repeated throughout history, yet people never learn the lesson that history teaches. So we see people today saying the same thing - all with a score of zero.

You are correct that at 1 Thessalonians, Paul expected the Coming to take place while "we who are still alive". When that failed to eventuate, someone - well after Paul's death - tried to calm down their heightened fervor and wrote 2 Thessalonians.

Doug

26

Source material: "144,000" and "anointed" in The Watchtower, 2000-2015

by Doug Mason in

a collation of statements made in the watchtower from 2000 to 2015 of "144,000" and "anointed".

http://www.jwstudies.com/wt_magazines_from_2000_to_2015_on_144000_and_the_anointed.pdf .

doug.

Doug Mason

Steve,

This overview of recent statements in The Watchtower is revealing, showing for one example, the dramatic shift that took place in 2013 to the Watchtower's foundations. This pattern of moving the goal posts is a regular phenomenon, even when they do it to their own foundations.

When will the WTS find their foundation Truth if it is regularly changed ("adjusted" in WT parlance)? Or is loyalty more significant than honesty?

Sure we will find people we do not agree with ("nutters"), but at least we must permit people to have their ideas, which is a luxury that is not exercised by the autocratic Governing Body.

Doug

26

Source material: "144,000" and "anointed" in The Watchtower, 2000-2015

by Doug Mason in

a collation of statements made in the watchtower from 2000 to 2015 of "144,000" and "anointed".

http://www.jwstudies.com/wt_magazines_from_2000_to_2015_on_144000_and_the_anointed.pdf .

doug.

Doug Mason

Charlie,

I fully respect your right to you having your beliefs. I am asking you in all sincerity: why believe the Bible? Have you researched Lower Criticism, Higher Criticism, or the canonisation processes?

It is too easy to hide behind pigeon-holes such as "skeptic" without addressing the substance.

If your foundation is only belief, then do not be dogmatic that you are correct and that you "know" other interpretations are incorrect.

On what basis do you know that the writers at Rev 7 and Rev 14 were explicitly referring to that text in Isaiah?

Doug

26

Source material: "144,000" and "anointed" in The Watchtower, 2000-2015

by Doug Mason in

a collation of statements made in the watchtower from 2000 to 2015 of "144,000" and "anointed".

http://www.jwstudies.com/wt_magazines_from_2000_to_2015_on_144000_and_the_anointed.pdf .

doug.

Doug Mason

Please tell me, Charlie, since you accept this kind of ideology:

Where is this "heaven" place physically located? (The ancients said the sky (firmament) was solid with God sitting just above it, taking a personal interest.)

How do they keep in contact? How long does a message take to be delivered?

What will happen when earth is devoured when the sun is destroyed?

Why do people accept superstitions? Why should stuff written under the name of "Isaiah" be accepted? What was written originally? What is your proof that the writers of Revelation had this text in Isaiah in mind, given that they were written some 700 years apart?

What about the billions of other planets?

Thanks,

Doug

26

Source material: "144,000" and "anointed" in The Watchtower, 2000-2015

by Doug Mason in

a collation of statements made in the watchtower from 2000 to 2015 of "144,000" and "anointed".

http://www.jwstudies.com/wt_magazines_from_2000_to_2015_on_144000_and_the_anointed.pdf .

doug.

Doug Mason

A collation of statements made in The Watchtower from 2000 to 2015 of "144,000" and "anointed"

http://www.jwstudies.com/WT_magazines_from_2000_to_2015_on_144000_and_the_anointed.pdf

Doug

1

Source material on "1935"

by Doug Mason in

early watchtower sources dealing with the identification in 1935 of the great crowd:.

http://www.jwstudies.com/1935_in_divine_purpose_and_contemporary_publications.pdf .

doug.

Doug Mason

Early Watchtower sources dealing with the identification in 1935 of the “Great Crowd”:

http://www.jwstudies.com/1935_in_Divine_Purpose_and_contemporary_publications.pdf

Doug

24

Andromeda awaits the "Great Crowd of Other Sheep"

by Doug Mason in

the great crowd, the other sheep will live forever on planet earth.. years will move from centuries, millennia, and millions of years to billions of years.

after 4 billion years, the sky will fill as their milky way galaxy and its neighbouring andomeda galaxy collide, with amazing changes in gravitational forces.

what an amazing sight!.

Doug Mason

The Great Crowd, the Other Sheep will live forever on planet Earth.

Years will move from centuries, millennia, and millions of years to billions of years. After 4 billion years, the sky will fill as their Milky Way galaxy and its neighbouring Andomeda galaxy collide, with amazing changes in gravitational forces. What an amazing sight!

One billion years later, after surviving the collision of two galaxies, the Great Crowd of Other Sheep will experience the sun expand and self-destruct.

What will the Watchtower magazines be saying at the time?

Doug

10

Apocalyptic 2 Esdras 2

by Doug Mason in

await your shepherd; he will give you everlasting rest, because he who will come at the end of the age is close at hand.

be ready for the rewards of the kingdom.

... receive what the lord has entrusted to you and be joyful, giving thanks to him who has called you to heavenly kingdoms..

Doug Mason

EdenOne,

As I research further, I now have doubts as to which was written first, and I likely need to retract my initial assumptions. The OT canons that contain 2 Esdras are from Christian sources (Epiphanius, Jerome, Council of Carthage, Alexandrinus, Some Orthodox, Latin Vulgate).

Although tradition attributed it to Ezra, that is by no means reliable. As we know, the practice of false attribution extended to several of the NT writings attributed to Paul and to Peter.

So I will take a cold shower on that one.

Doug

10

Apocalyptic 2 Esdras 2

by Doug Mason in

await your shepherd; he will give you everlasting rest, because he who will come at the end of the age is close at hand.

be ready for the rewards of the kingdom.

... receive what the lord has entrusted to you and be joyful, giving thanks to him who has called you to heavenly kingdoms..

Doug Mason

EdenOne,

That is exactly the point I was hoping someone would observe.

It indicates to me that the writers of Revelation did not have any of the claimed euphoric experiences, but they rewrote existing earlier Jewish material. (2 Esdras is included in some canons of the Hebrew Scriptures - OT.)

Revelation makes little, if any, reference to contemporary Christian writings. That being the case, this contradicts the WTS's statement that certain NT passages in the Gospels, Acts and Epistles refer the 144,000.

(The number 144 is significant in Hebrew gematria.)

Doug